With the number of drug overdose deaths dropping, some are celebrating. But is there a risk in declaring victory too early and cutting funding for prevention? Today’s guest on Grieving Out Loud, an addiction researcher at Stanford, says not so fast. About 72,000 overdose deaths a year still exceeds the total number of Americans who died in the Vietnam War.
Dr. Wayne Kepner says not only are far too many people still dying, but celebrating too early could cost more lives. He recently wrote an article titled, “America must not learn to live with 72,000 overdose deaths a year.”
In this episode of Grieving Out Loud, Dr. Kepner shares what history has taught us about past drug epidemics, and how those lessons can guide the path forward while preventing as many deaths as possible.
Related episodes:
- A Drug Historian on What America Keeps Getting Wrong About the Fentanyl Crisis
- Can We Save Lives While Cutting Funding? A Tough Conversation at the Top
- How Do We End the Fentanyl Epidemic? A Candid Conversation with a Former DEA Chief

MEET THE GUEST
Dr. Wayne Kepner
Dr. Wayne Kepner is an addiction researcher in the Department of Psychiatry at Stanford University School of Medicine, where his work focuses on integrating evidence-based treatments into real-world health systems and communities. He brings both academic expertise and the perspective of someone in long-term recovery to one of the most urgent public health conversations of our time.




